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Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

Posted on: February 24, 2012 12:35 pm
 
Josh Hamilton

By C. Trent Rosecrans


After his most recent relapse, the Rangers put their extension talks with Josh Hamilton on hold. Despite the way the Rangers have supported Hamilton through two public relapses, the former MVP said he doesn't feel like he owes the team and doesn't expect an extension before the end of the season, when he can become a free agent.

Speaking to reporters on Friday, Hamilton had this to say (via the Fort Worth Star-Tribune):
"The Rangers have done a lot for me, but I've got a question for ya'll: Have I done a lot for the Rangers?" Hamilton said. "I think I've given them everything I've had, and I don't think anybody can say I haven't. When it comes down to it, what people don't understand, is this is a business.

"I love Texas, I love my fans, I love the fans of the Rangers, I love the organization, I love my teammates, I love everything about it. But I'm not going to sit here and say I owe the Rangers, because I don't feel like I owe the Rangers."
I have a good friend who is a Rangers fan and she's not happy with the comments, and I can see how Rangers fans would feel that way. On the other hand, he's been paid to do a job and he's done it. If the Rangers weren't happy with him or his ability to do it, they don't have to offer Hamilton a contract after the season -- I'm pretty sure someone else will. That's the beauty of the free market.

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Comments
lilonstitch1
Since: Feb 23, 2012
Posted on: February 27, 2012 11:11 am
This comment has been removed.

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Since: Jun 25, 2009
Posted on: February 27, 2012 10:11 am
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

Redwing, I really wouldn't mind if the Rangers and the Tigers are both in the post season again next year and I hope they meet for the American League title. A true fan doesn't want any patsies on the way to a championship, and the winner of a series between those two teams would know they earned their way into the World Series. 

Respect.

Malloman. Believe this, anybody that beats the Tigers in the playoffs ( assuming we get there) I'll cheer for to win it all.  The only exception is if the Yankees are the team to do it since i can't get myself to cheer for that team, you could pay me and I can't do it.

And if the Tigers do meet the Rangers and the Rangers beat them again, I will have nothing to say except for a big congrats !  The Tigers are a year older, some young players with experience they didn't have before. They'll have a deeper pen and I think an even better starting pitching staff and a deeper pen soon enough.   If that's not enough to beat Texas there's nothing anybody can do except hope Texas takes down whoever else they play.

 



Since: Dec 24, 2009
Posted on: February 26, 2012 9:27 pm
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

I don't think Verlander was used up at all, I just think he got hit a couple times against a great hitting Texas lineup.  Against the Yankees he pitched 8 innings, gave up 4 runs but if you watched that game the 4 runs didn't tell the story.  Verlander looked awesome in all but one inning, maybe it was the 6th ?  Other then that, 9 base runners in 8 innings with 11 strikeouts....  And it was only his 2nd appearance in the playoffs, first in 5 years. I think the experience will be good for him next time. And the Tigers already signed a good free agent reliever and a couple kids are a year older, that might help in the depth department.

Apologies for my syntax... I actually was saying that Verlander was one of the ones who did not look like he was suffering from overuse. He seems to be one of those players who can stand up to the rigors of a long season. He's arguably the best pitcher in baseball.

Your Colby Lewis example if he pitched overseas is ok, except for the fact he's not a great pitcher and certainly wouldn't be worth a 100 million dollar investment.  Until 2 seasons ago he struggled a lot, and after one good year 2 years ago his era jumped to 4.40 last year. Not too bad, a quality starter. But certainly worse then the year before and far from a superstar pitcher.

True, Colby was a mess until he went to Japan for a few seasons and learned how to pitch. And his record was not great last year but I recall that the bullpen blew saves for him that cost him at least a couple of victories. And I'm sure it happened but I can't recall the offense coming from behind to give him a victory. He eats innings.

But Colby Lewis won't be the opening day pitcher because he's the Ranger's best pitcher... that title probably belongs to Derek Holland. If he's the starting day pitcher it will be as a reward for being a superstar pitcher in the post season.

Redwing, I really wouldn't mind if the Rangers and the Tigers are both in the post season again next year and I hope they meet for the American League title. A true fan doesn't want any patsies on the way to a championship, and the winner of a series between those two teams would know they earned their way into the World Series.

Respect.



Since: Jun 25, 2009
Posted on: February 26, 2012 6:31 pm
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

Well, at least you didn't pronounce me wrong out-of-hand this time. And yes, last year's series was close and I did watch it. And the thing I remember most about Detroit during that series was that their main players were used up. Verlander and a few others notwithstanding, it just seemed like too many of the players were used up. I'm casting a wide loop here, but the one example I can come up with is Victor Martinez. He was just so banged up and having been in a tight division race, didn't get an opportunity to heal. Probably led to his being unavailable for this year.

A few Detroit players were playing injured in that series, no doubt about that at all.  VMart certainly had some issues physically, Delmon Young was basically playing on one leg and Alex Avila their catcher could barely run to first base.  The Tigers did make a couple corrections this year that should help them in the long run.  Avila won't be overused this year, they signed Gerald Laird to back Avila up, play at least once a week or a bit more.  Delmon Young is going to DH a lot next season as well, he won't be in left field very much, especially in comparison to last year.  I don't think Verlander was used up at all, I just think he got hit a couple times against a great hitting Texas lineup.  Against the Yankees he pitched 8 innings, gave up 4 runs but if you watched that game the 4 runs didn't tell the story.  Verlander looked awesome in all but one inning, maybe it was the 6th ?  Other then that, 9 base runners in 8 innings with 11 strikeouts....  And it was only his 2nd appearance in the playoffs, first in 5 years. I think the experience will be good for him next time. And the Tigers already signed a good free agent reliever and a couple kids are a year older, that might help in the depth department.

You forget that Colby Lewis came to the Ranges from that other country and a league that employs very few MLB type hitters. And Colby Lewis will likely be the Rangers opening day pitcher. You can fall back on American superiority all you want, and in many cases it will be true in baseball. But it does not necessarily follow that it can't be untrue. Oh, and in that foreign league, Yu Darvish performed head and shoulders above Colby Lewis.

First of all I never once said Yu Darvish is going to suck, I simply stated that it's 50-50 and that nobody knows what's going to happen.  Your Colby Lewis example if he pitched overseas is ok, except for the fact he's not a great pitcher and certainly wouldn't be worth a 100 million dollar investment.  Until 2 seasons ago he struggled a lot, and after one good year 2 years ago his era jumped to 4.40 last year. Not too bad, a quality starter. But certainly worse then the year before and far from a superstar pitcher.

Like I said, Darvish might be great... but he also might not be. I still like C.J wilson who has at least 4 or 5 really good years left that I know is going to pitch well over a pitcher from Japan that may or may not do well.

But that's just me.... I'm not saying Texas fans have to agree.  I just wish I would have commented on some threads months ago where Texas fans were all over these boards telling everybody how important it was to keep C.J, if i would have commented at least I'd be able to copy and paste and show you.  What I find funny is the second Ryan told everybody Darvish is going to be the man, Texas fans bailed on Wilson. 






 



Since: Dec 24, 2009
Posted on: February 26, 2012 10:51 am
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'


I have no idea what's going to happen if the Tigers play the Rangers again in the playoffs next year.  But if you're implying the Rangers would automatically beat the Tigers in a 7 game series again ( which is exactly what you implied) then you missed the Detroit Texas series last year.

The Rangers needed 6 games and 2 of those wins in extra innings to get the job done.  If they play again it's 50-50.. nobody knows.


Well, at least you didn't pronounce me wrong out-of-hand this time. And yes, last year's series was close and I did watch it. And the thing I remember most about Detroit during that series was that their main players were used up. Verlander and a few others notwithstanding, it just seemed like too many of the players were used up. I'm casting a wide loop here, but the one example I can come up with is Victor Martinez. He was just so banged up and having been in a tight division race, didn't get an opportunity to heal. Probably led to his being unavailable for this year.

Of course the Rangers had their walking wounded too, like Josh Hamilton. He had a hernia but not from overuse since he had spent a lot of time on the DL.

But the point I'm trying to make here as to why I think the Rangers won last year and why they would do so again if you make the playoffs, is because the Rangers have more depth. They've got 7 quality starting pitchers and some of their position players who are backups could start for other teams. (David Murphy for example)

Darvish doesn't have a past, he comes from another country and a league that employs very few MLB type hitters.  Maybe he'll be good, maybe not.  But it's a gamble...

You forget that Colby Lewis came to the Ranges from that other country and a league that employs very few MLB type hitters. And Colby Lewis will likely be the Rangers opening day pitcher. You can fall back on American superiority all you want, and in many cases it will be true in baseball. But it does not necessarily follow that it can't be untrue. Oh, and in that foreign league, Yu Darvish performed head and shoulders above Colby Lewis.



Since: Jun 25, 2009
Posted on: February 26, 2012 12:57 am
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

Redwings 1969, I think you are afraid of the Rangers and the moves they are making because you know you may have to face them in the playoffs. But you gotta realize, trying to undermine them here on a forum isn't gonna save your sorry butts if you do make the playoffs. '-)

I have no idea what's going to happen if the Tigers play the Rangers again in the playoffs next year.  But if you're implying the Rangers would automatically beat the Tigers in a 7 game series again ( which is exactly what you implied) then you missed the Detroit Texas series last year.

The Rangers needed 6 games and 2 of those wins in extra innings to get the job done.  If they play again it's 50-50.. nobody knows.

 And while Darvish may not be the second coming this year, once he gets acclimated all the signs of his past indicate he will soar

Darvish doesn't have a past, he comes from another country and a league that employs very few MLB type hitters.  Maybe he'll be good, maybe not.  But it's a gamble....
 



Since: Aug 20, 2010
Posted on: February 25, 2012 5:36 pm
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

Hamilton has done everything he is suppost to do as a baseball player period. He has played hard and everyday evidently came to the ballpark to play. He does not owe the Rangers anything he has furfilled his contract period. As far as his health, well he has been hurt a couple of times but has produced time and time again. What about Cruz, he has been hurt more times than Hamiliton but no one mentions that. Yes, Hamilton has a problem a big problem with alcohol and drugs. He is tested like 3 times a week all year around, so if he does fall back into drugs the MLB and Rangers will be the first to know. I am sure there is some time of accountability clause in his contract that if he test positive for drugs then the contract is void. He did not break any laws by drinking or getting drunk, yes those were bad decisions, but everyone makes bad decisions sometime or another in there lives and he is no different. If he stays clean from drugs and he has up to this point (zero positive test for drugs) then in my opinion he is just as reliable as he was last year or the year before that. MLB is a business and it is a "what have you done for me now business" as far as the owners are concerned in my opinion. So I can pretty much quarantee that if Hamilton produces like the elite player he is then if the Rangers dont offer him a contract then I am sure there are several other teams that will and will spend alot of money to get him to play CF for them.



Since: Dec 24, 2009
Posted on: February 25, 2012 5:33 pm
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

You're wrong.  The accountability partner you're talking about was the organization's idea, it was something they did to try and help protect their investment.  Hamilton didn't ask for that in his contract, that was something the team put in place.   The problem in MLB is guaranteed contracts, but as long as the CBA says all contracts are guaranteed then too bad so sad for the owners.  If there is a clause in the CBA that says they can cut Hamilton then cut him.  If not, once again, it is what it is...
Your arbitrarily saying I'm wrong doesn't make it true. I can just as easily argue that you are not the final arbiter of right or wrong, so I'm going with my gut and steadfastly saying I'm right.

What I'm saying is that Hamilton owes every employer who has to put in place extraordinary measures to keep him on the right track, because if he f's up again, he will likely be banned from baseball for life. So, if a team puts up with his extraordinary circumstances, they also help to insure he is able to keep drawing the big bucks in baseball. He takes a big paycut if he is banned for life.

How do you see the upside of letting C.J go for Darvish?  He hasn't even thrown a pitch to a major league hitter yet.  We know for sure C.J's era was right at a very nice 3 or just below the last 2 seasons, I believe his only 2 full seasons as a starter.  We know C.J did this in a hitters park where, especially in the summer when balls fly out of there at a rapid pace.  What we don't know is how Darvish is going to do against real competition.  Yes, Nolan Ryan was a great pitcher and he's a good manager, but it's half retarded to think that he KNOWS Darvish is going to do well.  I like the Rangers, and if they aren't playing the Tigers I cheer for them against teams like the Bosox and Yankees that I don't like at all.  But once again I can't stress enough the Rangers took a huge risk signing Darvish over C.J... we'll see how it pans out.

Everyone with any gumption realizes that C. J. has hit his ceiling. Any changes in his performance will be downward from now on. And while Darvish may not be the second coming this year, once he gets acclimated all the signs of his past indicate he will soar. Darvish is 25 years old. C. J. is what, 30, 31? Plus, C. J. hasn't performed well in the post season, so we know that is a red flag. Darvish has handled rock star status with aplomb for his entire baseball career. I don't think something like the post season will unduly faze him.

And as for the Rangers taking a big risk signing Yarvish over C. J., well, I'll trust Jon Daniels's judgement on that one. He's actually the one who lobbied Ryan to go the Darvish route. And, a couple World Series trips the past two years buys him a lot of trust in my mind.

Redwings 1969, I think you are afraid of the Rangers and the moves they are making because you know you may have to face them in the playoffs. But you gotta realize, trying to undermine them here on a forum isn't gonna save your sorry butts if you do make the playoffs. '-)



Since: Jun 25, 2009
Posted on: February 25, 2012 3:05 pm
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

And the Rangers don't owe him anything. Sign him for one year, there's no reason to be on the hook for ? if/when he lands in the drunk tank headed to rehab.  This isn't the first time he's falling off the wagon, anyone want to bet it doesn't happen again?  I'll be a penny.


You're right, probably 100 percent correct with everything you said.  One, the Rangers after his contract is completed owe him nothing and two, there is always a great chance an addict falls off the wagon and screws up again.  But, you suggested a 1 year contract? LOL

I GUARANTEE you as long as Hamilton stays clean next season and puts up big numbers, multiple teams will try and sign him to a long term deal worth an insane amount of money.   If you're betting against teams throwing huge offers at Hamilton then you better stick with that penny bet.



Since: Nov 14, 2009
Posted on: February 25, 2012 2:35 pm
 

Hamilton says he doesn't 'owe the Rangers'

And the Rangers don't owe him anything. Sign him for one year, there's no reason to be on the hook for ? if/when he lands in the drunk tank headed to rehab.  This isn't the first time he's falling off the wagon, anyone want to bet it doesn't happen again?  I'll be a penny.



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