Flacco contract effect on Cutler pending deal

I was thinking about this as I listened this morning on my way to work the Mike & Mike show on the radio.  They were talking about how Flacco's agent is wanting him to be the highest paid QB in the league.  That is mind blowing to me because even with his playoff performance, I still think he is only a borderline top 10 QB. 

We have heard all the stats about his playoff wins but early in his career he was a game manager and the defense was the reason they won.  I think one of his playoff wins he had less than 100 yards passing.  Mike & Mike also listed off some mind blowing stats of just how average this guy has been.  Do you know he has never made a Pro Bowl?  Not even being selected as an alternate as the main selections decline to play.  His QBR and Passer rating are extremely average.  Before this season, he only had 4 TD passes in the playoffs and 7 INT's.

Now I could care less what the Ravens do with Flacco.  If they want to give him $20 million a year, I say go ahead, but by doing that they are pretty guaranteeing that this Super Bowl run was the end of their team.  They are currently $5 million OVER the cap and as Mongo pointed out, the CAP is going to be flat this season.  This is before they sign him to a new contract.  So if you work the cap with a long term contract, at best he will account for about $12 million against it and you will be $17 milliion over!!!!  They are going to need to restructure or cut about $25-30 million in salary just to field a team.  Emery needs to watch the waiver wire on that team because they are going to be dropping like flies.

How this effects Cutler is that he is coming up in a contract year.  Emery is faced with the decision of trying to sign him to an extension or ride it out and Cutler is faced with the same decision Flacco had to make.  I think they should do an extension now if Emery indeed wants Cutler to be the long term answer.  If the Bears make a similar run to the Ravens next season and they win the Super Bowl.  Cutler is going to cash in just like Flacco.  I would try to lock him up now and not face overpaying Cutler next season like the Ravens are inevitably going to do with Flacco this season.  The QB market is horrible right now and the sooner they lock Cutler up the better it will be for the Bears.

What are your thoughts?

I think Emery rides it out, and he should. I'd rather risk eating a larger contract for more success. Cutler still hasn't proven much of anything.

I think Joe Flacco holds all the cards but one.  I think Ozzie Newsome's best bet is to tell Joe "look, yuo earned the contract; got the SB win.  However, if you want the big bucks--I'll pay, but be prepared because there's a brobdingnagian chance you will lose one or two of Anquan Boldin, Dennis Pitta, Jacoby Jones, or all 3."

Will he handicap them, to a point.....it would greatly behoove him to ask for less money like Tom Brady did, even a couple million that gives his GM something to do.
 
If he gets the big bucks then complains that he only has 1 reliable target--hes got no one to blame but himself.  I would like to see him handcuff baltimore, but I think Joe will take a modestly less salary than expected.  16-17 mil a year.

It certainly sounds like the people in Joe Flaccos camp want a 20M per year type deal, the words "highest payed QB in the league" have been floated around.

I really pitty the Ravens. They are gonna have to pay this guy likely something in the 18-20M dollar a year range, because if they dont some other stupid team probably would. Its really going to hurt them. Like patg said, even taking a 15M per year salary would help the Ravens out and if Flacco actually cared about winning thats what he would do, but we'll see.


As for Cutler. I see no reason to not sign him now. His value really cant get a whole lot lower, but if Trestman improves this offense his value will go up. May as well just lock him up now.

I dont see Flacco's deal affecting Cutler at all unless Cutler goes to the playoffs next season and puts up impressive numbers while making at least the NFCCG 

I just don't think you can take the risk of Cutler having a great year and then next year demanding $18-20 million.  Why risk it?  It again comes down to who will you replace him with?  You don't sign him to an extension and let him walk or trade him next season you are still stuck without a QB.  Regardless of how you think Cutler has played, he is still easily better than half the QB's in this league.  This is why Flacco is getting paid, all it takes is one good year, average to above average play and not even a whole year because if the Ravens don't make the playoffs he is looking at $15 million a year max, maybe less.  If Emery and Trestman feel Cutler is the future of this team, lock him up now, don't wait.  If you don't and gamble like Flacco and the Ravens did, you could end up losing, depending on which side you are on.

Cutler has not done anything to show hes worth half of 20 million.  I doubt Flacco will get 20 million, if Jay does have that kind of season, god bless him, he deserves to get paid for it.  As for now, he is not in a position to use anything Flacco does as negotiatinig leverage.  

If Flacco gets $20 million of Baltimore, that will pretty much do it for them next year.  They have too many unrestricted free agents and that much money tied up in one player will be too much.   They cannot franchise him either.  I will say this, if Flacco gets $20 million it won't be from Baltimore.  And this should have no, absolutely zero, affect on Jay Cutler's contract.  

<p>I cant see how Flaccos deal has any impact on Cutler if they work out the details this year. Schaub is a better comparison. I think Cutler has a lot to prove and if they wait till the end of 2013, his comp will be a reflection of next years performance.</p>

  If Emery and Trestman feel Cutler is the future of this team, lock him up now, don't wait.  If you don't and gamble like Flacco and the Ravens did, you could end up losing, depending on which side you are on.

That does make a lot of sense. Why wait? The guy is a good quarterback. I think that they should make him a viable offer and talk to him about building a real offense around him.

If the Bears make a similar run to the Ravens next season and they win the Super Bowl.  Cutler is going to cash in just like Flacco.

If that's the case I will take it and so will Emery and the Bears. We'll take a Super Bowl win with Jay and sacrifice the salary cap for a couple years. Well at least I would, maybe I'm just speaking for myself.

I also think Emery rides it out. He and Trestman have no allegiance to Cutler and if Cutler turns in a mediocre campaign, there may be no incentive to even franchise him the next year. Make Jay prove himself and earn that contract. 

I also think Emery rides it out. He and Trestman have no allegiance to Cutler and if Cutler turns in a mediocre campaign, there may be no incentive to even franchise him the next year. Make Jay prove himself and earn that contract.

I kind of agree.  Cutler has not proven himself to be elite or indespensable.  But, he's the best chance we have, in the short term, at a Super Bowl.  Ideally, Cutler signs for what he's worth - an above average QB with potential to be elite.  

I also think Emery rides it out. He and Trestman have no allegiance to Cutler and if Cutler turns in a mediocre campaign, there may be no incentive to even franchise him the next year.

It seems that Emery or Trestman haven't commited themselves to Cutler in their press conferences, and perhaps are willing to roll the dice this season without committing to him with a long term contract, but I guess we'll see. I do wonder what was said about Cutler in their interviews, I would think there would have to be some sort of commitment there at least one would think. I'm tired of making excuses for Cutler be it the offensive line or  the coordinators he's going to have to crap or get off the pot. I'm tired of this offensive constipation.
I think Trestman will see where he is in camp and see how willing and able he is to adapt to his system before there is any talk of an extension. I think Jay has all the tools in the world to be a very successful QB, but lacks the composure to be a great QB. Much of that can be attributed to the talent around him as well as the coordinators and can be corrected, but IMO some of that can be attributed to the fact he is a type I diabetic, and too often that is overlooked as a reason he is the way he is.

Go Bears

I think the Ravens are crazy if they break the bank for Flacco.  I'm not questioning whether or not he is a good QB - certainly he is a top 10 QB in the NFL (we can debate where he fits in exactly).   But is he on par with QBs like Brees, Brady, Rodgers and Manning?  Nope.  The other thing to consider is that the Ravens aren't built as a pass happy team and Flacco's career stats reflect that.  He's never thrown for 4000 yards, he's never had more than 25 TDs in a year and his career passer rating is just 86.3.  Do those numbers justify $20 million per year?  Not at all.  

But that being said, Flacco and his agent will point to a stellar winning percentage during the course of his career (54 - 26 in the regular season) and the 9 - 4 record while leading the Ravens to 5 straight playoff appearances.   And it certainly doesn't hurt to go into negotiations after the kind of postseason that Flacco put together.  It really doesn't get any better than that.  11 TDs, zero INTs and one Lombardi Trophy is a dream for an agent beginning negotiations on an extension.   

But will his contract have an impact on what the Bears do with Cutler?   I don't think so.  Cutler simply can't point to the same type of TEAM accomplishments as Flacco to justify a top tier contract.    But there is no question that the Bears will have pay significantly to keep Cutler in the fold.  Schaub's contract is probably a pretty good template ....... roughly $13 million per season and almost half of the contract guaranteed - $29.15 million in Schaub's contract.  I can't see Cutler having a legitimate claim to a more lucrative contract but regardless, I think they should get a deal done before the 2013 season. 

 

I'm tired of making excuses for Cutler be it the offensive line or  the coordinators he's going to have to crap or get off the pot. I'm tired of this offensive constipation.

I am with you 100% on this Tuna.  While those are legitimate reasons for his failures, it is time to put up or shut up.  The firing of Lovie Smith had a lot to do with him not being given a chance to succeed from a coaching standpoint.  The positive is this.  The best seasons he has put together were with Shanahan and Martz.  I think Trestman is as good as offensive mind, if not better, as the two of them and will be a lot better at developing him and building an offense on his strengths than Martz ever could.  Trestman is cut from the same offensive mold as Shanahan, who obviously got more out of Cutler than anyone else.   

But will his contract have an impact on what the Bears do with Cutler?   I don't think so

A few of you have said this but I am looking at it this way.  In the offseason last year, Flacco was offered around $15 million a year as an extension.  He has some big balls turning that down but he did and rolled the dice hoping to get a better deal.  It paid off.  Now, if the Ravens don't make the playoffs or make this run, it would be ridiculous for him to ask for $20 million a year based on his regular season performances and his past stats.  Prior to this Super Bowl run, would any of you say that Flacco was that much better of a QB than Cutler?  Yes he has had more playoff success but that was more a product of being on better teams than it was based on his play.  Did anyone think prior to these playoffs that Flacco could carry a team at any point? I sure as hell didn't. I still don't think he is anything more than above average, just got really hot at the right time and had some breaks fall his way.  (Rahim Moore not knowing how to take a proper angle to knock down a pass).

If you can lock Cutler up for 5 years at $13 million per like Schuab, I say do it now.  I would love for us to make a run next season and Cutler be a huge part of it.  I just don't see taking a risk if you can lock him up now.  Some of you have made the point that he hasn't done anything and if he doesn't improve, we can just let him go.  My first question is always, who do you replace him with?  Part of the reason Flacco will get $20 million is there is nothing else out there.   Half the teams in the league are looking for QB's.  Matt Flynn just got $10 million to go to Seattle and he didn't even start.  People are lining up right now to bid on Alex Smith, who a until a couple years ago, was considered a bust.  He will probably get $10-12 million a year.  Would you rather have him than Cutler?

I just don't see how with an offensive minded coach, a hopefully improved offensive line and probably even more weapons than he had last season that he doesn't get better.  We went to the freaking NFCCG with Hester, Bennett and Knox as WR's.  We were 7-3 and looking very good the next season, until the Cutler injury, with Roy Williams added to that mix.  He will be better, I say lock him up now and don't take the risk of having a Flacco situation where you have a QB who in his contract year plays out of his ass and gets about $5 million more a year than you can get him extended for now or than he is actually worth.

Ozzie Newsome is the best in the business but I would hate to be in his shoes right now.  They are in cap hell and signing Flacco is only going to put him deeper.  He is basically going to have to dismantle a Super Bowl team just to sign a QB, who until the past 6 games, did not show an ability to carry a team.  Obviously winning a Super Bowl is a great thing but I don't see how next season they aren't almost completely rebuilding.

What I find interesting in this discussion - is what is more important?

- Winning a Super Bowl, and then having your QB cripple the franchise so that you likely won't win any more?
- Slightly overpaying for an existing QB but locking him in so that if you do win a Super Bowl, it doesn't cripple the franchise and you might win multiple (or at least make multiple trips)?

I would not be upset if they decided to extend Cutler now when the cap is friendly, based on what he's worth now especially.  I guess it depends on how many years Cutler has to prove he's the Franchise QB.

- Winning a Super Bowl, and then having your QB cripple the franchise so that you likely won't win any more?
- Slightly overpaying for an existing QB but locking him in so that if you do win a Super Bowl, it doesn't cripple the franchise and you might win multiple (or at least make multiple trips)?

This is not what the Bears are facing right now but very well could be.  I look at the Bears as being very similar to the Ravens.  Built on defense and trying to transition to offense.  The biggest difference between us and them is the offensive line.  If we had that line this past season, we would have been a completely different team.  In my opinion, it is always better to lock a guy in early.  Waiting to see what happens backs you into a corner.  Right now Emery has the upper hand and will until after this season.  He can franchise him next season but you really don't want to do that to a starting QB, it can really cause some animosity and team division.  Look at the whole Drew Brees thing, that almost blew up in the Saints face and could have contributed to their crappy season.  There is no pressure right now to get it done but I just don't think you can sit back and wait on this.  We have no viable options to replace him and even if they draft one this year, they are going to be a project who is going to need a few years to develop.  QB is always one of the highest salaries and this will also give Emery a number he will be able to work with in regards to the cap going forward.

If you want to protect yourself in regards to the CAP, front load the contract so if he ends up not working out over the next few years, you can cut him or trade him and it won't kill the CAP.  Plus the Bears are set up well under the CAP this season as well as the next.  I just don't see the Bears having many options if they want to win.  Right now we have Cutler and that is it, we don't even have a legitimate backup.  Letting Cutler go would mean a complete rebuild.