Garza

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Garza

February 12, 2013 12:01 am

CBS fantasy sports has an update of todays date, listing Garza out until "at least" late February.  But, I can't find anything else out anywhere on the net.   Was this expected all along for precautionary measures?  Is it a new development?  Anybody know?
 
sjddaj
SinceOct 4, 2006
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Garza

February 12, 2013 12:20 am

Dont touch Garza, he'll get drafted high and will get zero run support thus be around .500, go with someone on a good team that has a good hitting team playing in the weak NL Central.  Latos might be taken when Garza goes, I'd take him instead.
Crzy Jo
SinceMar 20, 2008
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Garza

February 12, 2013 11:33 pm

It appears Samardzija turned down a 4-5 year offer from the Cubs this offseason.  Wonder if Garza did the same.
willrust
SinceOct 24, 2006
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Garza

February 13, 2013 2:55 am

Well, I just read an article on Cubs.com that Shark and Cubs havent talked a contract in months. Shark said something along the lines that he doesnt deserve a long time contract yet. He said the Cubs and him did talk about a long term contract, but he ended up just signing for 1 year.

I assume he said that because he probably thinks he can get a lot more money in a year. He did well last year, but Im sure if the Cubs did offer a contract it was well below market price. Another good year could jump him up millions of dollars.

Garza is making a lot more than Shark. Garza also said he really enjoys it in Chicago. I would venture to guess if the Cubs had offered a multi year contract to Garza and he turned it down. Someone would have got wind of it. Im sure him and the Cubs have talked but I doubt anything real serious.
SilenceS
SinceMar 19, 2008
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Garza

February 13, 2013 1:24 pm

[Matt Garza]'s tenure with the Cubs may extend beyond the 2013 season thanks to the draft compensation rules currently plaguing [Kyle Lohse] and his chances of signing with a team, says [Gordon Wittenmyer of the Chicago Sun-Times].




Well, I just read an article on Cubs.com that Shark and Cubs havent talked a contract in months. Shark said something along the lines that he doesnt deserve a long time contract yet. He said the Cubs and him did talk about a long term contract, but he ended up just signing for 1 year.

No. 1 starters are usually well paid. Samardzija is aware of the business of baseball.

"It doesn't make much sense to sit down and try to negotiate anything out when I don't have a full season under my belt," he said. "Now we're just talking potential."

If the Cubs had gotten Samardzija to agree to a long-term deal this past offseason, it might have been at a lower cost.

"I don't know -- I'm not a [general manager]," Samardzija said, laughing. "You tell me."


He was being smart.  He knows his value is not peaking and the Cubs tried to lock him up at a lower cost durring that time.


 

CFS77
SinceJan 13, 2010
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Garza

February 13, 2013 1:43 pm

He was being smart.  He knows his value is not peaking and the Cubs tried to lock him up at a lower cost durring that time.

The perameters of the deal are not known, but the Cubs (according to Gordon Wittmeyer) offer Samardzija a 5 year deal prior to his 1 year arbitration signing.  The 5 year deal would have paid for 3 year of remaining arbitration and 2 years beyond (FA after the 2017 season).  If you take the arbitration perameters of 2.64M for this year and extrapolate that over a 5 year contract (2.64M in 2013, 5M in 2014, 8M in 2015, 10M in 2016 & 10M in 2017) the Cubs likely offered around 35-40M.  Sure that would be a club friendly 7-8M per year deal if Samardzija pitches like he did last year or continues to improve.  But, we all know the track record of power pitchers the Cubs have developed over the past 10-15 years; and they do tend to suffer from injury. 
willrust
SinceOct 24, 2006
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Garza

February 13, 2013 2:56 pm

Sharks mechanics are way better then Woods. Wood was an injury waiting to happen and it happen many times. Prior had the mechanics of a God, but was also a p****. Sorry, no other way to put it. Sure, he got hurt but Prior was a nancy boy about playing with any kind of pain. Shark could wind up hurt just like every other pitcher in this league but if you weigh the risk factors. He would be a low risk factor. His mechanics are good. He is built for the long haul. He gets stronger as the game and season go on. He would have been dumb to sign an extension with the Cubs. He has another good year. His price rises tremendously. There are not many pitchers that start the game throwing 97 and end the game throwing 97.
SilenceS
SinceMar 19, 2008
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Garza

February 13, 2013 3:46 pm

I'd put down a bet that Shark tops 16 wins next year.  With a sh*tty run support.


Back to the topic:

On Whitmeier's comment about Loshe's hang up affecting Garza I don't buy it much.

All it affects is if the Cubs plan on retaining him to the end of the year and hoping to get a comp pick.

Their options are extend or trade those are not affected.

If they were planning to let him go via F/A in the first place that would have been the same case with Dempster.  Why trade him when they would get something regardless.
CFS77
SinceJan 13, 2010
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Garza

February 13, 2013 3:50 pm

 Prior had the mechanics of a God, but was also a p****. Sorry, no other way to put it. Sure, he got hurt but Prior was a nancy boy about playing with any kind of pain

Prior went through a string of injuries.  He had a torn Labrum, screws put into his shoulder.  He tore his calves early on which let into him depending un hs upper body more.  He was avg 135 pitches per game in his rook year.

He was abused pure and simple and his body broke down.

Until you go through major injury like this don't make ignorant opinions about it.  
CFS77
SinceJan 13, 2010
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Garza

February 13, 2013 11:29 pm

Ummm lets see. Prior averaged 113.4 pitches per start in the regular season. It was in Septemeber that the number increased. Kerry Wood also threw a 180 pitches for his HS baseball team the day before he was drafted. Pitchers get abused. He hurt his achilles. He got hurt by a line drive off his elbow. He got hurt with a strain oblique. He also had what they called a loose shoulder which they said came about because of his lack of conditioning. Kerry Wood went through much more than Prior and perservered. Prior never got himself in great shape. Was he absued? I am sure by todays standards. I suggest you look up some of Priors quotes when he couldnt out perform Wade Miller for a starting job in 2007. I dont have to go through a major injury to understand them. Priors injuries has as much blame on him as anyone else.
SilenceS
SinceMar 19, 2008
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Garza

February 14, 2013 2:44 am

In his second start of 2003, he shut out the Expos, struck out 12 and didn't walk a batter. By May 12, he was 5-1 with a 2.13 ERA. On June 26, he struck out 16 Brewers in eight innings. On July 7, he and young Cubs ace Kerry Wood were on the cover of Sports Illustrated holding baseballs with flames superimposed between them. The headline was "Chicago Heat." Dusty Baker had left the Giants after losing the 2002 World Series to the Angels and took the Cubs job. Now he had Wood and Prior as his 1-2.

Prior's momentum didn't slow down until July 11, when he collided with Braves infielder Marcus Giles and bruised his right shoulder. He made the All-Star team but was on the disabled list. He came back Aug. 5 and pitched six shutout innings against the Padres in his hometown. Then came two straight complete-game victories, including a 131-pitch effort on Sept. 1, six days before his 23rd birthday, in which he blanked the Cardinals for eight innings. It was his sixth win in a row and he was 14-5 with a 2.36 ERA. He had given up three earned runs in his previous 47 innings.

Teammate Eric Karros called what Prior was doing to batters "a joke," but anyone who thought Prior made it look easy didn't see the agony behind it -- the moments he'd spent screaming his head off, always in the sanctuary of the clubhouse, by himself, throwing balls at lockers, cursing his imperfections. They saw a statuesque sculpture on the mound. They started counting the trophies.

On Sept. 6 in Milwaukee, Prior threw another 129 pitches for another win. The Cubs were 75-67 and a half-game behind Houston for the National League Central division lead. The next day he turned 23.

By the end of the regular season, with the Cubs on their way to the playoffs, Prior had finished a stretch in which he'd gone 10-1 in 11 starts, including 13-, 14- and 10-strikeout games in succession to end the regular season. The pitch counts for those games: 124, 131, 133.

On Sept. 26 on ESPN.com, statistics prodigy Nate Silver and injury expert Will Carroll wrote that, "In the terminology of pitching biomechanics, Mark Prior is a freak." Another source was quoted in the article as saying, "He's the model; he's perfect."

Silver and Carroll mentioned that Prior had been worked more heavily that season than "all but four other pitchers" in their "Pitcher Abuse Points system," but it didn't seem to be too much of a concern.

"There are five major principles of proper delivery that can be summarized as balance, posture, anatomical position, rotation, and release," they wrote. "Prior is textbook with all five."

They ended the piece with a caveat, a reminder that it all could fall apart, just as it had for other hyped pitchers: "Mark Prior is human."

October arrived, and Prior threw a two-hit complete game in his postseason debut, beating Atlanta in Game 3 as the Cubs took the NL Division Series. His pitch count was 133.

In Game 2 of the NL Championship Series against Florida, Jerry Prior watched from the stands along with Mark's mom, brother and sister, family and friends as Chicago's offense scored seven runs in two innings. Mark walked off the mound with an 8-0 lead after five. The Cubs, after losing Game 1, had a laugher in the bag to tie up the series.

 

Jerry picked up the golf pencil that he'd clutched during all of Mark's games clear back to Little League -- his nervous-habit pitch counter. He looked down at his scorebook. Only 73 tally marks. This couldn't have been better -- an official game, maybe one more inning and a great setup for a possible Game 6. It was even better when the Cubs scored three more in the bottom of the inning.

But Prior came out for the sixth, the seventh, the eighth. By the time he really was done, having given up two solo homers, he was at 116 pitches. The Cubs won, 12-3.


As always with the Cubs or any team believed to be cursed, there was plenty of blame to sprinkle around -- on closer LaTroy Hawkins, who had given up a game-tying three-run homer with two out in the bottom of the ninth against the Mets on Sept. 25. On Dusty Baker. And, yeah, even Mark Prior. He had missed the first two months of the season with Achilles tendinitis and made just 21 starts that year, pitching 118 2/3 innings. His record was 6-4. His ERA was 4.02. Fans could be encouraged after Prior's final start in '04, a nine-inning, 16-strikeout effort, but the Cubs lost that game.


The next year wasn't any better. On May 27, 2005, a line drive hit by Colorado Rockies outfielder Brad Hawpe broke Prior's right elbow, forcing him out of action for a month in an otherwise productive year with 11 victories. The Cubs finished 80-82.


The following spring, Prior strained his shoulder, missed the first two months of the season, and wallowed through two more disabled list stints before packing in 2006 with a 1-6 record, a 7.22 ERA, and an established reputation among Cubs fans. Prior was no longer a thoroughbred. He was broken-down, soft and content to sit on the disabled list and collect his checks. Another disappointment in a century-plus full of them.  (sounds like you)

Teammate and close friend Glendon Rusch heard about it at his golf club in Southern California one day when a member of his foursome found out he was a Cub. "Whatever happened to Prior?" the guy asked Rusch. "Did he just fall off the face of the earth?"


Here is the reallity:

Here's what happened: Prior got seven screws put in his mangled shoulder -- torn labrum, rotator cuff and anterior capsule -- by Dr. James Andrews in April of 2007 and missed the whole year. He shuttled back and forth from San Diego to see Andrews in Birmingham and to rehab at home. That December, the Padres signed him to a one-year deal, knowing he wouldn't be ready until June of 2008 at the earliest. In May, Prior was in Peoria, Ariz., at extended Spring Training, trying to face hitters. He could hardly throw a strike, and the ones he did throw were getting crushed by kids who weren't yet in A-ball. He was tired after 20 pitches. Dead tired. He threw one more and almost fell off the mound. He said, "I'm done," walked into the clubhouse and couldn't pick up his arm for a half-hour.

Prior had torn the capsule again, this time clean off the humerus bone, but he wasn't deterred from his plan to make it back. Dr. Heinz Hoenecke operated on him in San Diego, the Padres signed him to a Minor League deal for another shot, and in June 2009, back in Peoria, he tore it again.

 




Seriously dude you need to chill on him.  Even to this day he is still trying to make it back after amost losing the use of his arm.   

Lesser dudes would be pounding 40's taliking about what was....he is still out there trying to get a gig. 
CFS77
SinceJan 13, 2010
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Garza

February 14, 2013 11:11 pm

I need to chill on what? You went into a tangent calling my opinion ignorant when it was not. I found Prior to be weak minded and thought his **** did not stink. I made that opinion on things I read and things I saw. It may be because he was young and thrown in the spotlight but that was my opinon. I granted you he did get hurt. Never disputed that. I also think some injuries was just him getting in his head. Also, you completely blame the way he was used as the reason for his career being derailed. Well, they have been experts that believe his mechanics actually is what caused his problems. Some agree with it. Some dont. I am not an expert on mechanics so I couldnt tell you. It is my opinon and it was based on facts whether you agree with it or not. So, we can move on from this argument because it really does not matter.
SilenceS
SinceMar 19, 2008
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Garza

February 14, 2013 11:41 pm

You went into a tangent calling my opinion ignorant when it was not. I found Prior to be weak minded and thought his **** did not stink.


And the fact he is trying to get back to this day after all of his arm issues shows that he has plenty of drive and your statement comes up shallow.

I took it personally because I tore my labrum 5 years ago lifting and it still affects me to this day.  His was way worse.  And he is still out there throwing.


All I'm going to say is until you go through major injury and rehab don't make ignorant opinions.

You have done this on Stewarts wrist also.  I broke my wrist in the military and couldn't finish my career due to it.

He is still out there trying to cut it.


If you have issues about these players take a second and relise what it takes to even to play at that level.  They are all eliete and we all are not in their class of talent.

None of us can really judge  players and weak-minded....just to get to that level takes plently of trials of them selves to get better and finally to get to that level.

If they get injured and want to try to preserve their lively hood more power to them.  Who the hell are we to judge how a person goes out and makes a living for them self. 
CFS77
SinceJan 13, 2010
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Garza

February 15, 2013 6:15 am

None of us can really judge  players and weak-minded.
We certainly can.  When Epstein decides to sign those "questionable" players, to ML contracts, for this rewarding journey, rather than to win games and sign players that are less questionable.

You would think that if The Mighty Epstein was so hesistant to accept the trade for Haren because of his medicals.....

Apparently, Vizcaino's medicals were not an issue ? Makes sense to me. 

He would have done the same for all the other questionable, injured, and mostly potential garbage he has signed.

Including trash heap players from overseas and trading capable mid to low level ML players for injured lightning in a bottle.

mountsalami
SinceMay 17, 2009
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Garza

February 16, 2013 4:25 pm

Yet again, you are taking this personal for some reason. I have a opinion about Prior that I made because of comments he has made and things I have read. I came to my own personal opinion about him. You also keep assuming things. I broke my wrist horribly when I was in HS playing football. My wrist got turned into an S shape and I had to have a pin put into my wrist. I was lucky and my recovery was quick once the cast was removed and I did not lose strength or range of motion. On the other hand, my friend broke his wrist and he was never able to be as strong as he once was before it. Different people deal with injuries different ways. The Stewart thing had to do with basically his teammates and management in Colorado fell out of favor with him because they didnt think he would play with bumps and bruises. Tulo was quoted that certain players in the Rockies locker room were more worried about their next pay check instead of going out there and playing. There is a difference between being hurt and being injured. Every athlete is hurt during the season. Most play through it. Stewart was thought as one of those players that would not. I think I will take the advice of ones of Stewarts peers over two dudes talking on the internet. Im pretty sure Sveum even took a jab at Stewart last year.
Also, Im not really sure what the last line meant because I dont complain if a player makes a million dollars or a 100 million. More power to them for getting as much money as they can, but I can have an opinion on them still. I dont know where you were going with this. Like I said we have differing opinions on these players. Lets just move on.
SilenceS
SinceMar 19, 2008
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Garza

February 16, 2013 8:13 pm

You would think that if The Mighty Epstein was so hesistant to accept the trade for Haren because of his medicals.....
The same medicals the Nationals took a look at before signing Haren to a one year $13 million contract.

Just one of many reasons that the Nationals are looked at as one of the favorites in the NL this year while the Cubs are the laughing stock of the NL this year and a favorite to draft in the top 5 again next year.

Isn't it great !!!!! 
mountsalami
SinceMay 17, 2009
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Garza

February 17, 2013 12:59 am

Well the Marlins and Astro's will both lose 105 or more games so their a lock for #1 and #2 and the Cubs,Rockies and Royals will battle for the #3 thru #5.
cena
SinceAug 19, 2006
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Garza

February 18, 2013 7:57 pm

Back to Garza. Strained L. Lat. MRI on Tue. Looks like the depth is going to pay off earlier then expected. Good news it is not arm related. But, I am glad that Jed and Theo have been using a extra starter approach. When Prior and Wood were out Jim did not really supply extra pitching depth and settled for untested AAA talent to back fill.
CFS77
SinceJan 13, 2010