Lakers a contender now?

Casual fan?  Okay.

As for "all the couching"/defense issues you raised, they're interrelated and simple: (1) Playing the right way; and (2) Gasol carving out an inspired bench-finisher role.  Those are both feasible, and playing the right way on the offensive end naturally tends to lead to better defensive play, both of which the Lakers have shown capable of.  We're bigger than OKC, SAS, and MIA.  I tend to think that's important in the playoffs.  And if you don't think the Lakers have the pieces to be an extremely dangerous team on the defensive end, then I'd question how casually you're paying attention.      

Big Red Slugs: Not close minded, realistic..Don't understand your logic, or if your really serious? If Some Laker fan's are on the fence, as the Lakers chances..after the road trip, everyone will see if the Lakers are for real? Meantime, I have to believe(my) favorite team, The Celtics, like past seasons, will surprise(many) so called experts, and advance further in the playoffs, because even the top teams with gaudy records, are beatable, especially if Rondo returns.plus they have quietly been adding needed players, while many posters are believing, only the Heat, The Bulls, The Knicks and Pacers are the top contenders. Go Big Green!!!

What's hard to understand?  I thought I was pretty clear and getting redundant.      

Didn't know there was a chance Rondo could make it back this season.  

1) Playing the right way;

There are a number of teams that if those teams play the right way and the Lakers play the right way, the Lakers lose.  So you should change this to "Playing the right way while teams better than us don't".  If those circumstances happen then sure they can beat a team that is better than them.



Those are both feasible, and playing the right way on the offensive end naturally tends to lead to better defensive play, both of which theLakers have shown capable of.  


They've shown capable of one of those two things.  They are still #18 in points per 100 possession allowed (i.e. defensive rating).

We're bigger than OKC, SAS, and MIA.  I tend to think that's important in the playoffs.  

Oh the "we" comes out.  Now I see where this is coming from.  

Sure you are bigger than these teams.

     Los Angeles: Avg Height: 6'7" Avg Weight: 220.6
     Oklahoma City: Avg. Height: 6'7"  Avg Weight: 224.5
     San Antonio: Avg. Height: 6'6" Avg Weight: 221.3
     Miami: Avg .Height: 6'7" Avg Weight: 220.9

Size is important in the playoffs.  Good thing all these teams have size.  Good thing for three of these teams they also have some athleticism on the defensive end to go with it.

And if you don't think the Lakers have the pieces to be an extremely dangerous team on the defensive end, then I'd question how casually you're paying attention.

This is an answer that people typically give when they can't provide any evidence to back up their claim.  Just question if the other guy is watching and provide no evidence on the subject.  You sound pretty confident though.  How much have you put on the Lakers to win the title?

 

The Celtics, like past seasons, will surprise(many) so called experts, and advance further in the playoffs, because even the top teams with gaudy records, are beatable, especially if Rondo returns.plus they have quietly been adding needed players, while many posters are believing, only the Heat, The Bulls, The Knicks and Pacers are the top contenders. 

The Celtics will probably go further in the playoffs then the Lakers but not because they are any better but just because they play in the Eastern conference.  

I don't understand the hostility.  And this is weak: 

Los Angeles: Avg Height: 6'7" Avg Weight: 220.6
     Oklahoma City: Avg. Height: 6'7"  Avg Weight: 224.5
     San Antonio: Avg. Height: 6'6" Avg Weight: 221.3
     Miami: Avg .Height: 6'7" Avg Weight: 220.9

We both know what I'm talking about in regard to the Lakers being bigger than those teams, and it isn't an average of the whole team.  

Don't look now, but the Lakers have won 13 of their last 18 games, since their closed door team meeting in Memphis on 1/25/12 to help right the ship, to finally get themselves back to .500 after a disasterous, injury marred, chemistry fractured, start to the season.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-b
all-dont-lie/kobe-bryant-dunks-josh
-smith-lays-game-winner-140114943--
nba.html

Kobe is the glue that is keeping this team together and reaching for the stars as he plays at an almost unprecedented level.  In spite of the early season failures, these Lakers - who are now clearly started to gel as a cohesive, focused unit - are contenders this season because of Kobe's singular will to win, even now in the twilight of his storied career.  Haters can try to write him and the team off however they want to, but I'm not sure I want to be the team that opposes the Lakers in the coming playoffs, no matter where the Lakers are seeded.  They will be a factor in this postseason, make no mistake about it.

Kobe is the glue that is keeping this team together and reaching for the stars as he plays at an almost unprecedented level.

wouldn't necessarily say that, Dwight Howard is getting healthier ... Steve Nash is getting more adjusted to his role, Kobe's will to win is overplayed, you mean to tell me that will to win is only at .500????  Don't buy it

Like Lakers team in the past, the healthier they are going into the playoffs - the better they are.  I give Kobe his due now but exactly where was this player in the beginning?  Don't get me wrong, better late than never but it's equally on his shoulders that the Lakers are in this situation as well as all the other players on the squad.  Give the other players credit as well as for getting this team on the right track.

Zag: "There are a number of teams that if those teams play the right way and the Lakers play the right way, the Lakers lose.  So you should change this to "Playing the right way while teams better than us don't".  If those circumstances happen then sure they can beat a team that is better than them. . . . They've shown capable of one of those two things.  They are still #18 in points per 100 possession allowed (i.e. defensive rating)."

Of course they're 18th in points per 100 possessions allowed.  Not to talk to you like a casual fan (I understand you're probably just trying to make an argument), but the problem with basing your entire argument in stuff like that, especially when you look at only a snapshot of it, is that you're only looking at an average of the season's past behavior all at once.  18th is actually better than I thought and shows improvement.  

Let your sensibility shine through and admit that the Lakers could feasibly be a title contender.

"Feasible": Notice I'm not saying they have to make this trade or that trade or get this coach or that coach.  My point in using the word "feasible" was to convey the literal sense that it is in fact doable as currently constructed.  I wasn't trying to be vague, misleading, or evasive.  I was trying to draw up a distinction I see between the Lakers and most other teams ahead of them in the standings.  

As currently constructed, I don't think it's feasible for DEN or MEM this season, and probably not LAC yet either.  In my book, only SAS, MIA, OKC, and maybe CHI and LAL are teams that I could feasibly see winning the title this season.         

     

Like Lakers team in the past, the healthier they are going into the playoffs - the better they are.  I give Kobe his due now but exactly where was this player in the beginning?  Don't get me wrong, better late than never but it's equally on his shoulders that the Lakers are in this situation as well as all the other players on the squad.  Give the other players credit as well as for getting this team on the right track.

I think that the biggest difference for Kobe is that the rest of the team is starting to get healthy enough and comfortable enough with each other, their roles on the team, etc. that Kobe is finally able to start playing the role that was envisioned for him when this team was put together.

Remember that when this team was first put together, the idea was that the Lakers would have Nash, Gasol and Howard to assist with the "heavy lifting". This was supposed to enable Kobe to just provide what the team needed when they needed it and be the "closer" (much like MJ in his final 3 years). However, with Gasol and Howard in and out with their injuries, Kobe had to score. Then when Nash went down, he had to play more of a point guard role with the assists as they were down to the 3rd string point guard.

Now, he is able to do things more as they were envisioned before the season started and play more of the closer role like he did last night.

Kobe is the glue that is keeping this team together and reaching for the stars as he plays at an almost unprecedented level.

wouldn't necessarily say that, Dwight Howard is getting healthier ... Steve Nash is getting more adjusted to his role, Kobe's will to win is overplayed, you mean to tell me that will to win is only at .500????  Don't buy it.

rd, give me a break - even for you, the avowed Lakers "team guy" and yet admitted Kobe detractor, this statement of yours is lunacy.  Kobe's "will to win" is always at 1.000, even when his team is at .100...Kobe has been the ONE constant, exceeding even his own lofty statistical standards, in this misbegotten season as the other key new pieces (Howard and Nash) have battled through fairly dire circumstances in their inaugural season with the Lakers.  Pau's been in and out of the lineup and the team has had to play through two different coaches!

There is no doubt that as Howard continues to round into form and Nash settles in, the Lakers will continue to get better and start realizing their lofty preseason expectations...but please don't sit here and tell me that Kobe was the guy who was holding this team down.

I give Kobe his due now but exactly where was this player in the beginning?

Right there, from day 1, playing at an All-Star level, day-in-and-day-out...as his teammates were shuttled in and out of the lineup as a result of every possible unforeseen circumstance anyone could've possibly imagined...

Give the other players credit as well as for getting this team on the right track.

Absolutely - but, again, the constancy has come from Kobe...Kobe and Metta - those are the only two guys that have been able to gut this season out from day 1 while remaining more of less free from injury.  The other thing that has finally helped this team get back on track has been MDA's finally having settled on a shortened rotation off the bench with Blake, Jamison & Meeks filling their roles nicely.

Listen, when Howard finally reaches 100% effectiveness, I'll be the first one to be singing his praises and giving him his due.

Don't look now, but the Lakers have won 13 of their last 18 games, since their closed door team meeting in Memphis on 1/25/12 to help right the ship, to finally get themselves back to .500 after a disasterous, injury marred, chemistry fractured, start to the season

They're beating teams they're suppose to beat. Good for them. Things are about to get a little tough for them though. I see them losing 3 of their next 7, possibly 4 of the next 7 if Rose is back for the Bulls game on sunday.

Remember that when this team was first put together, the idea was that the Lakers would have Nash, Gasol and Howard to assist with the "heavy lifting". This was supposed to enable Kobe to just provide what the team needed when they needed it and be the "closer" (much like MJ in his final 3 years). However, with Gasol and Howard in and out with their injuries, Kobe had to score. Then when Nash went down, he had to play more of a point guard role with the assists as they were down to the 3rd string point guard.

I don't necessarily buy the notion that it's ideal for Kobe to be the "closer" or that MJ hoisted late quite like Kobe.  Sure the ball should be in his hands late in the game, but I don't agree with all the isolation and highly-contested fadeaways.  

I think Kobe became the facilitator long after Nash had already come back, so Kobe didn't just take that role on because Nash went down.  Instead, I remember it being MEM that changed Kobe's approach and the Lakers fortune.  

 

There is no doubt that as Howard continues to round into form and Nash settles in, the Lakers will continue to get better and start realizing their lofty preseason expectations...but please don't sit here and tell me that Kobe was the guy who was holding this team down.

Never said that ... I think as a team they underachieved and that included Kobe.
Kobe's "will to win" did not translate at the start of this season, the results were there ... I understand when you have a injured Pau, Howard and Nash but guess what no player can ever "will to win" without a supporting cast, now that the cast is getting healthier ... now the "will to win" stuff is coming out again???  Really???

I understand that Kobe has a couple of seasons left ... it's time to look to the future, great he's playing well and the wins con-winky dink is right at about the time when the schedule isn't as strong AND the players are are gelling and getting healthy.  Kobe's year is about average given his age and to your point consistent ... but consistent to what, doesn't results in wins.

This is more this team getting together rather than Kobe's so called "will to win"

They will be a factor in this postseason, make no mistake about it.



Ive been hearing this for 2.5 years and this Laker team is weaker than both of those teams.

I don't necessarily buy the notion that it's ideal for Kobe to be the "closer" or that MJ hoisted late quite like Kobe.  Sure the ball should be in his hands late in the game, but I don't agree with all the isolation and highly-contested fadeaways.

When I say "closer role" I mean more along the lines of MJ. The ball was in MJ's hands more than anyone else late in games, but that didn't necessarily mean he always took the shot. He took the shot when he felt he was the best option (and sometimes, depending on how his teammates were playing, he was the best option even when doubled).

I agree, though, I think that the Lakers will be more effective when the offense is clicking well enough that they can move away from so many iso's etc.

I think Kobe became the facilitator long after Nash had already come back, so Kobe didn't just take that role on because Nash went down.

Actually, if memory serves, it started while Nash was out and then continued past when he returned while he played himself back into game shape. While I think Kobe tried to be the facilitator for too long after Nash came back, a positive in it was that Nash started looking for his own shot a little more and considering what a good shooter he is, that's not a bad thing.

Instead, I remember it being MEM that changed Kobe's approach and the Lakers fortune.

While none of us know exactly what went on in that meeting, my guess would be that it had to do with players worrying about playing the roles that were envisioned when the team was put together and that included Kobe playing the role that was originally envisioned for him rather than trying to do everything himself. Judging by the way they have been playing since, that is how appears to me.

  

Fair enough, trojanfan.  That seems sensible.  

They will be a factor in this postseason, make no mistake about it.

What is your meaning of factor? Winning a series? Winning 1 game? Winning 2 games?

If it is winning a series then they won't be a factor.

If it is winning a series then they won't be a factor.

Depends on who they play.

Currently, the best that the Lakers can hope for, in my opinion is a #6 seed (they are currently 3 games out of #6 and 2.5 games out of 7 and 8). This means a likely first round matchup with either the Thunder, Spurs, Grizzlies or Clippers. I would think that out of those 4, the most likely teams to make it out of the west are the Thunder or Spurs. If the Lakers are matched up with one of those 2 teams and pull off the 1st round upset, I'd say that they were a factor.

I don't understand the hostility.  And this is weak: 

Los Angeles: Avg Height: 6'7" Avg Weight: 220.6
     Oklahoma City: Avg. Height: 6'7"  Avg Weight: 224.5
     San Antonio: Avg. Height: 6'6" Avg Weight: 221.3
     Miami: Avg .Height: 6'7" Avg Weight: 220.9

We both know what I'm talking about in regard to the Lakers being bigger than those teams, and it isn't an average of the whole team. 

No we don't.  Tell me what you are talking about.  Even before I looked at the averages above the only team I really considered the Lakers as "bigger" than that you mentioned was Miami and they are the reigning champs so it really didn't effect them to much last year.  But maybe you mean something I don't understand in this regard, so please tell me.